AGRICULTURAL COLLEGE.
The PRESIDENT pro tem. announced the special order for this hour--being Mr. Hughes' State University Omnibus bill [S. 197]and called the Senator from Madison, Mr. Robinson, to the chair, the order of the Senate being to consider the bill as in Committee of the Whole.
Mr. BELLAMY. Mr. Chairman: I do not see the necessity of making an appropriation of twenty-five thousand dollars to the State University as proposed by this bill; and I do not think the passage of an act of this character would be for the advancement of the Educational interests of Indiana. The chairs in this University are all filled with men of ability and talents--as good as any in the west.
Now, Mr. Chairman, there is a bill pending before this Senate to make a sale of nine hundred acres of land in Jasper and other counties, valued at thirty-five thousand dollars and the sale of this land will make a sufficient fund to support two additional chairs.
But we find by the report of the Board of Trustees that their receipts for the last fiscal year were more than their expenditures. They had over a thousand dollars more than they could use to advantage. The professors got nearly three dollars an hour for their actual labors in that Institution. There has been on an averge heretofore, ten graduates per annum;--there may be an average of twenty hereafter. This appropriation added to the amount already appropriated to the State University would foot up forty thousand dollars per year for the graduating of twenty students, making the cost to the State for every one graduating about two thousand dollars. Now is it for the advancement of the interests of the people of the State to pay two thousand dollars a piece for graduates in the State University, when other institutions are graduating persons just as efficient without costing the State a solitary cent? There may be nine-tenths of the people who prefer to send their children or wards to private institutions of learning, or institutions of a secular character, and you tax nine-tenths for the education of the other tenth. This is certainly unjust and unfair.
There is a proposition in this bill to establish a Medical department in connectiou with the State University. Whenever the demands are sufficient for the establishment of a Medical College in this State, it will be established without any aid from the State. Bellevue College in New York, Rush Medical College in Chicago, and the Medical College in Cincinnati dont require State aid to keep them up--they are self-supporting; and whenever there is a demand for such inststutions they will spring up here, without any cost to the State.
Then there is a proposition in this bill for the sale of University square in the city of Indianapolis. Judge Hughes [the author of the page: 361[View Page 361] bill] can go no farther than I for the sale of University square for a proper and legitimate purpose. By reference to an act of Congress passed in 1820, we find that four sections of land were granted by Congress for the location of the capital of the State. The Legislature passed an act appointing commissioners to locate the site, approved June 1821 The Commissioners selected the site June 6, 1821, and another act was passed approving the selection--being the present city of Indianapolis, and two thousand five hundred and sixty acres of land and the laying off of the town. After this was done another act was passed providing that these lots were to be put up at auction--the monies raised from the sale to constitute a fuud with which to erect the necessary buildings. Another act passed February 21, 1821, designated a square for a Court house, another portion of land for a grave yard, and finally in an act passed in 1827, section five declares that square twenty-two is set apart for the use of a lunatic asylum and square twenty-five for the State University. Then it is as competent for the State to sell University square for the benefit of the State University as it was for the State to sell square No 22 for the benefit of the Insane Asylum. I am in favor of using square No. 25, as it was originally intended to be used, and that is by making a sale of it, and adding the proceeds thereof to the endowment fund of the State University. It would obviate any additional appropriations to the State University, and relieve us, perhaps, from the appropriation we are already making of eight thouand dollars a year to the University fund.
Mr. HUGHES (interposing.) If the Senator will allow me. All the State University asked two years ago was just what he now proposes to give her--her own. Sell this square and give it to her. He and the friends of the University can come to an understanding in five minutes.
Mr. BELLAMY. I have no understanding to come to with any one--I am speaking for myself. I believe the most of those who vote with me will unite on a proposition for the sale of University square for the purpose I have indicated.
The next thing in this bill is an appropriation of seventy-five thousand dollars for the State Normal School. I am in favor of as many more or less dollars as it is absolutely necessary for the proper furnishing and finishing of that building. I am not in favor of a useless show of ornamentation, but I am in favor or appropriating ever dollar necessary to make it an effective institution. And I am not in favor of adding it to the State University in any manner.
I am opposed to the next section for the establishment of an Agricultural College at the battle ground, for reasons not necessary now for me to detain the Committee in rehearsing. There are propositions pending for its location before a Committee raised especially to consider that subject and while that Commitee is acting in good faith, if the Senate desires to take the matter in its own hands and go ahead and locate it, that Committee had better be discharged at once for there is no further need of it--its labor is lost--its sessions are useless and there is no further need of it. I will not say it is insulting to the Committee but it presupposes that the Committee is not competent to consider the question referred to it.
In my judgment the proposition coming from Hancock county, to establish the Agricultural College at Greenfield, is much more preferable to any before us. It comes in the form of money--one hundred and twenty-five thousand dollars. The proposition from the Battle Ground comes in the form of buildings valued at one hundred thousand dollars and fifty thousand dollars cash. Now those buildings are situated some distance apart, and whether they are large enough, or whether the State would not be called upon to erect new buildings along side of these old ones, I have not the power to say. Hancock county is more easy of access, a more central and a more eligible situation. Then there is a proposition from Moore's Hill College, of buildings valued at fifty-thousand dollars, an endowment of thirty thousand dollars with lands enough for carrying on the college and asking only one-fifth of the Congressional donation, and pledging the carrying of the College on without cost to the State. That is a favorable proposition. But I will not detain the Committee by a further discussion of the matter, and will now give way to others.
Mr. JOHNSTON of Montgomery. Mr. Chairman: I move to amend the bill in the first section by striking out the word 'thousand.'
Mr. CHURCH. Mr. Chairman: I move to strike out the entire first section.
Mr. STEIN. Mr. Chairman: The manifest object of the Senator from Montgomery is to convert the entire bill into burlesque--to cast ridicule on the entire proposition. The Senator from Porter moves to strike out the entire first section. That would leave the State University without any endowment whatever. It is another method of attacking the life of the entire bill, conceived I grant, in somewhat more of a spirit of seriousness than the amendment of the Senator from Montgomery county.
I am decidedly in favor of this bill as an entirety and I trust it will be discussed as an entirety before it is smothered or set aside. I grant there is something appaling about this omnibus bill in some minds. I find from the tone of certain articles in the public press that page: 362[View Page 362] the stupendeous character of this bill is altogether impressive--that there is something in its vastness, and the charge is made that there is a ring, a combination, etc., connected with it.
In regard to its size, I am not aware that it is larger in comprehension than a great many bills we pass; and not a session passes by but we are called upon to cast our votes upon two particular bills, which in number of subjects bound together by general titles stand a poor comparison to the bill at present under consideration. Why, the laws of 1867 have one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine pages devoted to an act making general appropriations, and in these nine pages figure fifty-eight different sections, and every one of these sections devotes a large amount of public treasure to a specific and separate purpose, and yet they are all bound together by the general object of necessary public expenditures. The Senator from Switzerland voted for the general appropriation bill of 1867, and yet this omnibus bill No. 197, falls into contempt beneath the general appropriation bill of 1867, and so of the specific appropriation bill of 1867.
But it is charged that the bill indicates a ring or a combination. I had hoped that the fangs had been drawn out of that charge when the Senator from Monroe [Mr. Hughes] frankly admitted that the bill contained what it purported--a combination. Is the bill for that reason to be trodden under foot in this chamber? In whose interest does the combination appear? It has been conceived in behalf of the sacred cause of Education, and without reference to private interests whatever.
Mr. CARSON (interposing.) I will ask the Senator: Do the people of Indiana demand it?
Mr. STEIN. I have not stationed myself upon the housetop to invite the opinion of the people on the subject, and I do not think the Senator from Allen [Mr. Carson] knows. We stand here upon our individual judgments;our constituents, relying upon our individual judgments have sent us here. I say the people of Indiana do demand the most perfect system of education the Legislature of Indiana can devise. Some men have rheumatic sensibilities. I am afraid of the people when I depart outside of the line of my judgment, but while I am traveling within that line in which my conscience justifies me I know my constituents will justify me.
What is the underlying scheme in this terrific omnibus bill?--this bill which has brought to the surface so much abuse and feeling and denunciation from divers citizens of this State-- more particularly in the city of Indianapolis? It is the foundation of a system of education in the higher branches of knowledge and a little above that which is ordinarily attained by other schools--the university system of education. It proposes a system which I may say is charming, on account of its simplicity of details--a system which makes the University the parent head of all subordinate and adjunct colleges around which is to cluster a family of kindred colleges. The normal school was made a branch and it was originally intended to organize a law branch, but that has been voted down. It is proposed to organize a medical branch which shall be an adjunct--
Mr. CHURCH (interrupting.) I will ask if there is not already a law school at the University?
Mr. STEIN. Yes sir, this does not propose to organize a law school--it proposes to endow it, and get it upon an independent basis; but that is a matter not under discussion, because the Senate has struck it out. It proposes to establish a Medical College at Indianapolis, which likewise shall be a branch of the State University; and it proposes to take hold of the magnificent donation by the Federal Government, and it proposes to settle the question of locating that college, which must arise at this session or the next or we lose all of it. What is there atrocious about this scheme? Why is it that gentlemen are indignant as against those who are the defenders of this bill? Is there an inconsistent plan about it? It proposes to inaugurate a scheme of education which when the details are perfected will place our State in a way of imparting knowledge in higher branches than may be found west of the Alleghany mountains; and I may say east thereof.
Are Senators overcome simply because they have never realized such a scheme as this? We need something of this kind. Why is it that the youth of Indiana are sent abroad and have been for years? Because it is realized by the enlightened among our citizens--those who have the charge of the education of our youth, that within our borders the means of education are of a limited character. The State University itself has been the object of sneers and ridicule on the floor of the Senate at this session and at previous sessions. To take the judgment of some I have heard talk it is nothing but a kind of respectable high school, and lacking the qualities which makes it a State University--a seat of high learning. And why is this? Because it has never had a sufficient foundation and endowment. Two years since eight thousand dollars was voted by the Legislature and that as I understand it, is the first donation by the State in the way of endowment. An institution which was baptized years ago as a State University, which was intended to fill the idea of a State University page: 363[View Page 363] has been treated as a step-child would be by a cruel step-mother, and not until recently has it obtained support from the State. And I ask the Senator from Switzerland, did he vote for the endowment two years ago?
Mr. BELLAMY. I will say to the Senator I did.
Mr. STEIN. I am happy to hear it. It passed by a very meagre majority. Words of condemnation against that institution, and terms of derision applied to its poverty came from more than one Senatorial mouth upon this floor. If I am not mistaken one of the distinguished mouth pieces of the meeting at the Court House was one of the most conspicuous opponents to any gratuity to the State University. I entertain no hostility to this city--I take as much pride in it as any Senator, but there is a certain Indianapolis ring, not at all representing the real sentiments of the citizens of Indianapolis, that has been picking at this scheme ever since it was proposed to the Senate; and they are hostile to granting anything to the University. They have stood as lions in the path of that which might make it respectable and self-supporting, and they have been successful through an entire generation. While yonder school has struggled along in its poverty they have stood prepared to take the floor and cast their gibes and jeers at its scanty rags fluttering in the wind.
I am making it what its name purports--a State University. I have never been blessed with a collegiate education myself, much to my regret, but I have ever felt a warm interest in behalf of education. The present plan is to inaugurate a system--to have a central parent with children surrounding it--in which the specialities of science shall be taught, and in which the student desiring to make a speciality of this or that may have an opportunity to develop his special talent. I do not regard it as complete, but it lays the foundation of a system which must be fed by the legislature hereafter. It is a unit;--it has a oneness running through it--
Mr. CARSON (interrupting.) Would the Senator vote to appropriate twenty-five thousand dollars to the State University if it was not accompanied with the proposition to locate the Agricultural College at Tippecanoe Battle ground?
Mr. STEIN. I would, yes sir. And I would be willing to vote a great deal more; and I would be willing to face the intelligent people of the State of Indiana upon that proposition. Let us be scrupulous when we come to consider the salary bills and the appropriation bills; but must we contract our minds into the limit of a mustard seed when the high cause of education is in my hands? Whenever the cause of Education appeals to me, I must confess that I feel my liberality going out to meet it, for in no way can we invest the money derived from taxation to such high and precious advantage as in the cause of Education. It is the underlying principle of our insitutions, and upon it the safety of our land depends. Why is it that Senators oppose this bill? Because so many objects are blended together?--
Mr. CARSON (interposing.) What necessity is there for the establishment of a Medical College at Indianapolis, and where was it conceived?
Mr. STEIN. It matters little. The question is whether it is a proper and pertinent subject for Legislation. It is a matter of supreme indifference where the scheme was conceived.
Mr. HUGHES. It was conceived in the Legislature of Indiana, some years ago, when they passed an act authorizing the sale of the square--
Mr. STEIN. The necessity of a medical college in connection with the State University is apparent. All the great seats of learning have colleges of this character in connection with them. Why should we neglect this high and important line of science? There are but two propositions to appropriate money and how will we escape? The Terre Haute school demands and will not let us go hence in peace without making an appropriation. Do we propose to let that magnificent building lie there unfinished? Are we willing to bid farewell to the Normal School? We cannot do that consistently with the honor and the dignity of the State, and whether you do it by this bill or another you cannot shirk your duty and quiet your conscience. Why then not vote for it as it stands in this bill? The endowment of the State University is not adequate to its wants. Why is it that these two-penny institutions around the State turn out scholars that are a credit to themselves and would be a credit to any University, while the State University is under par?, It is on account of the inefficient endowment which it has had. No man can say that a University can be successfully conducted without the expenditure of sums of money?
Mr. GRAY (interposing.) I would like to ask if these institutions of learning who have done better than the Bloomington University were ever endowed?
Mr. STEIN. I do not know as to that.
Mr. HUGHES. With regard to the ability and learing of the faculty and the stand of scholarship the State University stands confededly at the head of all the institutions of learning in Indiana. There are graduates of that institution on this floor, and they may be found throughout the United States in all places of honor where scholarship or capacity page: 364[View Page 364] is required. I assert without fear of successful contradiction that the University of Indiana stands second to none west of the mountains.
Mr. STEIN. I accept all the Senator says. I referred to what came from other Senators upon this floor as to the disparity between the graduates of this University and the graduates of other institutions of learning in this State. But this University needs the endowment we ask to day. All we propose would be looked upon as a mere bagatelle by those high institutions of learning to which some of the people of Indiana send their children to obtain their education. I shall heartily vote for this endowment whether in this bill or separately, knowing that I am doing my duty to the youth of this State, to the State at large and to my own conscience.
With regard to a Medical College at Indianapolis, I should be glad to see the bill pass with all these sections. The friendly feeling with which this bill set out does not seem to be pursued by this locality. The citizens seem to think some horrid monstrosity is to be enacted upon them, if we are to judge from the public prints. We propose to found a Medical College here by selling University square and devoting the proceeds to its foundation. An enormous hub-bub has been raised about selling University square. This is looked upon as a high crime against the rights of Indianapolis. By the terms of law setting apart this square it was for a University. While Bloomington has asked for a number of years that the square shall be sold, those in the interest of Indianapolis have insisted that one of two things must occur--either the square shall be use as a site for a University or the square sold and the proceeds applied to the erection of some educational establishment in this city. We seize the latter idea and say let the square be sold and locate a College in your midst with the proceeds. But now this is not agreeable to the feelings of the adjoining property-holders, who insist that they must have an unobstructed view in front of their palatial residence. This dog-in-the-manger policy is what I cannot appreciate. As time rolls along this city is obtaining a sort of right to this square and after a while they will be pleading the statute of limitation as against the State of Indiana.
We come next to consider the question of the location of the Agricultural College at the Battle Ground. Now, I am personally interested, of course. I represent Tippecanoe county in this Senate, and the proposition is to locate the College at the Tippecanoe Battle Ground. The reason of the selection is this: that the county and two educational institutions, who have their seminaries adjoining the State grounds at the Battle Ground have made a proffer of them, and they were the first to present themselves asking for the location and proffering the donation. After Columbus had broken the egg a great many others could break an egg. After he showed the way a great many adventurers could discover America. After Tippecanoe county had made an offer a great many others came along. This is a practical question and it is for the Legislature to determine where it should go. I admit that we have no right to demand that the college shall be located there--we are but petitioners for its location. If in the wisdom and judgment of you Senators and our brethren in the other end of the capitol, it is not advisable to locate it at the Battle Ground, necessarily you must locate it somewhere, but I advise you gentlemen it must be located and that speedily, for the day of foreclosure is coming and that rapidly.
This donation was made in 1862, and the time for acceptance was subsequently extended for six years longer, and it expires in 1872. The Legislature of Indiana, that first recognized it was the General session of 1865, and the Legislative Documents of that date will show that Tippecanoe county was the first to recognize this act of Congress. It then proposed a donation to the State and asked for the location of this college. But there was no special selection at that time. It offered what was called "Stockwell Institute," in value somewhat equivolent to the offer now made. At the special session of 1865, the Battle Ground county, was again in the field--the first of all competitors. Was Indianapolis in the field those days? Was Greenfield in the field at that date? Wayne county was I remember, but Wayne county is no longer a competitor--it kinder voluntarily slid out. But Tippecanoe county has been a persistent petitioner from the time she first appeared upon this floor. In 1867, Tippecanoe county came down again with proffers of money and the Battle Ground Institute. The Senator from Switzerland [Mr. Bellamy] talks too jeeringly of this. The Senator has never seen these buildings or else he would not talk of them in that way. They cost about seventy thousand dollars and I am inclined to think seventy thousand dollars don't build small houses. The location is as picturesque and beautiful as can be found in the West. Those not familiar with the site I would advise to make a pleasure excusion there.
At a meeting recently held in the Court House one of the speakers jeeringly adverted to the probability of locating the Agricultural College in the woods of Tippecanoe county. I am inclined to think the cause of civilization would prosper a little more hereabouts if some more of that same kind of woods were more plentiful around this burgh. And one of them page: 365[View Page 365] talked about Academic groves, I believe. No more delightful groves can be found than those that cover the flats of Tippecanoe Battle Ground.
A VOICE. How about the artesian well?
Mr. STEIN. The well is not there, but students can find it I apprehend without difficulty. The location of the Agricultural College will be the location of that institution within a nest of its friends, and it occurs to me a community of its friends is something to be sought for. I say nothing of the historic associations which cluster around that ground, and which would extend the reputation of the institution; but I say of the community in and about the location that no community better ordered, better educated or more zealous in the cause of learning can be found anywhere.
If it is to be a matter of competition solely, probably those interested about the Kankakee swamps may come in and make an offer of half a million and ask that this college shall be located among the swamps and bullfrogs of the Kankakee. I say locate it where the society around conspire to give it character. It is for all these reasons combined I claim that the Tippecanoe Battle Ground still presents the best location. I understand there is an offer from Greenfield. What is that offer?
A VOICE. One hundred and twenty-five thousand dollars.
Mr. STEIN. That is what it is reputed to be, but I want the proof. I have heard that one half of that offer is made up by donations and subscriptions of private individuals and not guaranteed by public obligation.
Mr. KINLEY The County Commisioners offered a donation of one hundred and twenty-five thousand dollars, and I am informed--
Mr. STEIN. How did they ofier it?
Mr. BELLAMY. In three installments.
Mr. STEIN. Have we a certified copy of the order?
Mr. BELLAMY. Yes sir.
Mr. STEIN. So the offer is bona fide I am satisfied with it. Senators will bear me witness that I have looked upon Greenfield as honorable competitor.
Mr. HESS. There are eighty acres of land and parties are here ready to make the deed, north of the Railroad between that and the National road. There is a beautiful grove of timber on that piece of land. The balance of the land lies south of the Railroad, and beautiful creek--the Brandywine--the best liquor any man ever drank--runs through it.
Mr. STEIN. I see the Senator is addressing himself to prohibitory men, [laughter] but I am happy to find that Greenfield is as I hoped it was a bona fide competitor. I desired evidences of the offer for I had been privately told that a large portion of the offer was made up of subscriptions, and if that had been the case I would have protested against the consideration of the offer. I come to you with deeds in my hand which I will turn over; I come with buildings in my hands, I come with a donation of fifty thousand dollars--
Mr. HUGHES (interposing.) Is the Senator willing to vote for an amendment that Tippecanoe county will make it as good as the best offer before the Legislature?
Mr. STEIN. I will do that most cordially. Tippecanoe county takes no back seat in this work:--we are equal to the best on this floor:--we will make our offer as good as the offer from Greenfield or any other offer before us. But we don't propose to go into the market and have it knocked off to the highest bidder. The offer Indianapolis has made here might be condensed into a nutshell--in fact whenever made a bona fide offer. When Indianapolis commenced waking up her first demand was for time to draw up, and we were promised if time were given that an offer would be made. After the two weeks we gave were up the offer was not made. Indianapolis drags in the way of progress, and they did muster strength enough to get a further postponement. I see this same procrastination and delay, is again urged. We have but three weeks of the session left, and in three years more the limit of the law is out. I trust Indianapolis will show us what she proposes to do.
Two years ago an unprovoked slander was put upon the Battle Ground. It was bragged throughout this city that bribes had been offered from Tippecanoe county for votes. Such rumors were freely circulated, and by a man holding a responsible position upon the floor of that Legislature. I trust that whatever may be done henceforth, will be done in the way of honorable competition. I desire to do injustice to no one--I desire to meet all offers in a spirit of generous competition; but let no dishonorable words be said to run down the prospects of any. I trust the bill will not be amended so as to break the unity of the entire scheme. I trust it may pass as an entirety, subject to some slight amendments as will not mar it as an entire scheme.
Mr. CARSON. Mr. President: I did not expect to say anything upon this bill, but its friends and advocates here are so zealous that I have concluded to express my views upon the question. The bill before us, sir, is fraught with a good deal of interest, is argued with a good deal of force, and is the result of a good conception of no doubt very perfect and very able minds. I, sir, am opposed to the bill in all its provisions--every one of them--from the first to the last. I am opposed to making an appropriation of twenty-five thousand dollars to Bloomington; that is the first thing. Last session they asked from the Legislature a page: 366[View Page 366] small appropriation of eight thousand dollars. It was presented by the Senator from Monroe [Mr. Hughes] in the other end of the Captol, and I voted for it cheerfully because I thought it was right. The same Senator comes up with this magnificent scheme and in the short space of two years asks for an additional appropriation of twenty-five thousand dollars. This is pushing things rather rapidly. When they presented the University claims two years ago we granted the appropriation asked for, but did not expect that would be the foundation for further appropriations and appeals year after year.
Mr. HUGHES (interposing.) I desire to correct a matter of fact. What the State University asked last session was the sale of University square, which belonged to her then and belongs to her now, and have the money turned into an endowment fund. The appropriation of eight thousand dollars was the result of a compromise between the Representatives of the county of Marion and other Representatives and the county of Monroe. The understanding was that the State was to recognize the wants of the University and furnish it necessary funds as the Benevolent Institutions and instead of a bill to sell the square,a bill was brought up to litigation in the courts. The eight thuosand dollar appropriation passed with only four dissenting votes in the House, but the opposition of Marion county broke out here, and had it not been for the help of the Senator from Allen [Mr. Carson] and nine other Senators here the bill would have failed. The number of students in the State University has increased;-- the money has been well applied:--and if more is granted it will be equally well applied.
Mr. CARSON (resuming.) I do not know but my premises may have been wrong, for I was not aware that the Senator from Marion, and the Senator from Monroe had any kind of compromise in reference to this matter or I never would have voted for it. What the Senator from Monroe has stated in relation to that measure I fear will enter into this, and that is one of the principle reasons why I am opposed to the bill. I voted for that eight thousand dollar appropriation because I thought it was right in itself, and without reference to the understanding between the Senator from Monroe and the Representatives from Marion county. I claim that no understanding between the Senator from Monroe and any number of Senators or Representatives will authorize me to compromise my constituents and vote for a measure they may try to get through in that manner.
But to come back, sir, I say I am opposed to this measure because it is an appropriation of twenty-five thousand dollars to the State University which i could not go home to my constituents and justify. I am the only person in my section of country that has received any benefits from that institution, and I will accord to it all the Senator from Monroe claims, but I cannot justify before my constituents the voting of twenty-five thousand dollars to that institution.
Then, sir, I am opposed to the second proposition in the bill for the same reason. The legal profession are not asking for an endowment for a law school, and I am not disposed to anticipate their wants. We ought to learn a lesson from the past. The Halls of the Senate and the other end of the capitol once echoed with more extensive schemes than are contained in this bill. I refer to the old internal improvement system. And can it be said that an institution of this character may be established now and be self-sustaining--and the Legislature not be subject to calls for other appropriations in its behalf yeah after year? We had better look to the history of the past:--to the legislation of 1835, and that class of internal improvements which oppress us to this very day. Here is a magnificent scheme for educational purposes. But it is said we are called upon for a trifling sum, that is twenty-five thousand dollars annually for the State University, seventy-five thousand dollars for the Normal School, and five thousand dollars as a basis for a Medical College; and then establish the Agricultural College at the Battle Ground.
I am opposed to the whole scheme. I am opposed to the Medical College, because I do not think the medical profession require it, and the interests of the State do not demand it.
I am opposed to the sale of University square at this time, because I do not think it is a proper time. I would prefer waiting until the times are better. Had the University square been sold twenty years ago where would all the money be to-day? It has lost nothing by remaining where it is.
I am opposed to the location of the Agricultural College at the place proposed in this bill, because I do not think it is the proper place. If Indianapolis does not do something I shall vote for the Tippecanoe Battle Ground. Indianapolis is the place for that College. I would be in favor of memorializing Congress to allow the directing of this fund, so that every child in the State could receive some benefit from it; but if this cannot be done, I would prefer to see the college located near Indianapolis, if Indianapolis makes an offer as good as any other porition if the State, and it should be located within reach of street cars. If it is to be of public benefit it should page: 367[View Page 367] be located where it will be most accessible to the people of the State, and where it can do the greatest amount of good to the greatest number of people. Our courts meet here, and every fall the Masons and Odd Fellow's and other associations have their annual meetings here.
Mr. STEIN (interposing,) Lafayette is almost as much of a Railroad center as Indianapolis. Railroads go out from there like spokes in a wagon wheel.
Mr. RICE. I would like to know what is the benefit of these gatherings to an Agricultural College?
Mr. CARSON I suppose there will be a model farm connected with that Agricultural College, and lectures will be delivered in it; and I suppose that many would like to avail themselves of these lectures and examine the Agricultural implement used on the model farm.
Mr. KINLEY. Mr. Chairman: While I announce my intention of voting against this bill, I beg leave to state that I cordially endorse some things in it, and some things said in favor of it, but I do not endorse everything said against it. My first objection to it, notwithstanding the elequent language used in its defence by the Senator from Tippecanoe [Mr. Stein] is its omnibus--I do not say "ominous," but I might--but its omnibus character. It is not one proposition but many propositions-too many I think to be in several bills. It proposes to establish a unit school system with the State University at its head. I introduced a bill, myself, a few days since, placing the State University at the head of the Common School system of the State.
The proposed proposition for the Bloomington University should come up in the form of a resolution of the Senate, instructing the Committee on Finance to report the appropriation as an amendment to the specific bill.
Again, this bill proposes an appropriation for the Terre Haute Normal School. I am in favor of an appropriation for the Terre Haute Normal School as a independent proposition and will go as far as any other Senator in that direction.
Another appropriation is to establish a Law School in connection with the State University. That may or may not be right. Another appropriation is to establish a Medical College at Indianapolis. I do not think that is practicable. We have not one class of Medical practitioners in the State but several of them; and I think it is not proper to establish a State Medical University. Leave the practitioners of the several different schools to establish their own colleges.
Again, this bill contains a proposition for the location of the Agricutural College at the Tippecanoe Battle Ground. This is perhaps the great leading motive for this bill; and I am opposed to the bill for the additional reason that I am opposed to the location of the Agricultural College at the Tippicanoe Battle Ground. I do not think that is the proper place for it. And I do not think if it goes to Tippecanoe county that that is the place for it. It should be near a great city--
Mr. HUGHES (interrupting.) If the Senator's particular objection to the bill is the Tippecanoe Battle Ground, I ask how it was that he voted to strike out all the rest of the bill except that, and to leave that alone?
Mr. KINLEY. There were several propositions in the bill, and to my mind the question before the Senate should be that one thing. I voted to strike out and leave that, not intending to indicate that I should vote against the other propositions in case they were properly brought before the Senate.
With the Senator from Allen [Mr. Carson] I am happy to say that my preference, outside of my own locality, is the centre of the State. If Wayne county were in competition I should labor for Wayne county, and I think it is a good location. I think the interests of all and not of any one locality points to Indianapolis as the proper place for the Agricultural College; or, more properly, it seems to me it should be called the Industrial school, for it does not propose agriculture exclusively, but to be a College of all Industries. It should be located at Indianapolis because it is the centre of the State, and the centre for Railroads which radiate from it in every direction. Because the State Board of Agriculture meets here, the State fairs are held here, the business of the whole State centers in Indianapolis, and, if located here, it would be visited more frequently by citizens from every part of the State.
There are features in the bill in reference to the State University that I certainly could not support: for instance, the second section, which provides that the faith of the State is hereby pledged that the appropriation of twenty-five thousand dollars per annum shall never be withdrawn without the consent of the State University Trustees. That is, that the faith of the State is pledged that thirty-three thousand dollars shall be annually appropriated from the State Treasury to the State University. I do not believe we have the power to bind future legislatures in that way, and if we had I certainly should oppose it, because we do not know what the future state of the University may be or what its future wants may be.
Mr. HUGHES (interposing.) I will ask the Senator whether he in reality desires the success of that institution?
Mr. KINLEY. In reference to the State University I most certainly desire its success, and I am willing to make provisions that will page: 368[View Page 368] place that institution at the head of all the institutions of this State; and I would be glad to see it at the head of all the institutions in the United States.
Mr. HUGHES. I think the Senator misapprehends the second section. Senators will notice the fact that the Board of Trustees of the State University are to be appointed by the State Board of Education which consists of the officers of State. And the Trustees are not local. The President usually, is a citizen of Indianapolis but the other members are scattered all over the State. And that section which provides that the appropriation may be withdrawn, by no means limits the consent to a locality. The faculty ere but creatures of the Board, and the Board is composed of gentlemen from every part of the State.
Mr. KINLEY. Does any person suppose that any circumstances could ever transpire when that Board would consent to its withdrawal?
I think our common school system should be a unit system: but I am not willing to see this bill pass the Senate.
I believe University square belongs not to the University but to the State of Indiana. There is no question but that the lands lying east of the city--eighty acres south of the railroad and forty acres north of the National road--belong to the State of Indiana. That is one hundred and twenty acres. I understand this land is worth one thousand dollars an acre. It is of no possible use to the State now. It could be sold, and you would have something over three hundred thousand dollars--about three hundred and seventy-seven thousand dollars to be appropriated for the cause of Education:--part of it certainly--that arising from the sale of University square. Out of this you might add one hundred thousand dollars to the endowment fund of the State University, one hundred thousand dollars to the State Normal School, and leave nearly two hundred thousand dollars for the purposes of an Agricultural College, beside the sum to be given by the citizens of Marion, or some other county, for its location. I think we can do all these things without putting our hands in the pocket of the State, and I shall favor something of that kind.
Mr. CRAVENS. Mr. Chairman : During this whole term of the General Assembly I have felt a good deal of embarrassment in advocating the passage of any measure whatever. At the commencement of the session I was admonished, perhaps by advancing years to make the determination that this should be the last time I should ever occupy or seek to occupy a seat in the General Assembly. For that reason I was the more particularly desirous of looking back in the future with satisfaction to any measure I should be prominently associated with or that I should offer myself on this floor. And I was somewhat disappointed in this: that for reasons unsatisfactory to those who had the organization of this body I was awarded a position on a committee which practically removed me from resisting in shaping or originating any active legislation in this body. I was placed at the head of a committee which has not met for twenty-two years and which will not be likely to meet. I had the honor of being placed on two committees each of which by their own terms meet but once in a term of years, and his session not happening in any such term, I am relieved from any direct agency in giving direction to any legislation coming from this body. I speak of this in no spirit of complaining, but speak of it as my misfortune.
This measure is one that I have for years taken a deep and profound interest in. I regard it as one of the most profound measures that has come or will come for years before any future session of this body. I regard it as of such importance that it can be estimated only by the interest the people have in the perfection of our system of education.
I deeply regret that my honorable and distinguished friend from Randolph [Mr. Gray] caricatured the Normal School, the State University and other subjects in this bill, either one of which I thought might well engage the high powers of my distinguished friend. The Senator characterized the bill as an "Omnibus bill." I would recommend to my friend, the Senator from Randolph, that when next he tries his hand in that direction that he select some subject that may be made respectable by ridicule, so that his effort may not sink below the level of travesty.
The Senator from Monroe [Mr. Hughes] has been arraigned as though he were a criminal--I will not say inside of the Senate, because that would be unparliamentary--but in the public prints and on the streets. Why is this? Is there anything in this bill that is not already before this legislature in separate bills? Is there not a Normal School bill asking for an appropriation of one hundred thousand dollars? Are there not Agricultural College bills asking the Legislature to locate it at different points? And is there not a bill in the interest of the State University before you? It is the property of the people of the State and is entitled to the fostering care of the Legislation of this Senate. The Senator from Monroe has been villified, columniated and traduced. Why, some say this is a local institution--
Mr. GRAY (interrupting.) I wish the Senator to say who he talks about as villifying.
Mr. CRAVENS. I say the public press and people on the streets; the gentleman need not jump until he is spurred. Now I ask why should this be the case? This is not the prop- page: 369[View Page 369] erty of the Senator from Monroe. It is my property and the property of the Senator from Switzerland in the south, the Senator from Laporte in the north, the Senator from Vigo--in the west and the Senator from Wayne in the extreme east. And it is the property of two million of the people not on the floor of this Senate. It is the only University--the only College in the State of Indiana that belongs directly to the people of the whole State and to the people of all denominations--of all churches. And I say to you there is no institution in the State of Indiana that has been so meanly and so sadly neglected. Why one of your papers called it a Grammar school. Who made that grammer school? Who located it? Our fathers located it. When they talk about its being a grammar school, why is it? Up to 1867, the State turned her face from it. The Senator from Allen [Mr. Carson] asks if there are any petitions here praying for an appropriation to the University? The people sent him here relying upon his knowledge of its wants. They will not follow him with petitions for everything.
But I am not done with the other allusion. The Senator from Monroe has been assailed on account of this bill. If there is any crime in being its author then, for one, although I had no hand in its authorship, without consultation with the author, yet I endorse it and have for years endorsed every proposition in it, except as to one point or two. The control the State University is to have of the Agricultural College, the law college and the normal school, is not what I want. I want all of them institutions of the State. The Agricultural College, the normal school and law school, I want them all grouped under the shade of the State University, and I want them amply and liberally sustained.
Yet that Senator has been villified and calumniated. And why is it? He resides there. I suppose that Senator will pardon me if I allude to a fact in his early history. I was a student in that University and I remember well when the widowed mother of that Senator moved to town from Virginia, in order that she might avail herself of the advantages guaranteed by that institution in the education of her children. That Senator was educated there, and that University and the State of Indiana has no reason to be any thing but proud of the fact. There he married his accomplished lady, there his children were born, and there they are being educated. Would it not be strange indeed if he were false to the trust these people have placed in his hands. I honor him for his fidelity to that locality and for his love for his old alma mater. He is not the only man in that has been arraigned in this way for doing right.
Now I say this bill don't suit me exactly, but it don't suit me because there is not sufficient control in the management of the State University and all its various departments. I care not where the Agricultural College may be located. I would be very glad to see this institution rear its magnificent proportions from one of the beautiful hills in southern Indiana, where it would command a beautiful view of the whole valley of the Ohio river. I suppose the Senator from Wayne would like to have it in eastern Indiana, and I suppose the Senators from the north would be glad to have it rear its beautiful proportions at the foot of lake Michigan, but we can't all have it.
What is the dictate of common sense? To locate it where it would be most available to the largest number. Where is that? At Indianapolis? This is one place and Lafayette is another. I would prefer to see it along side of and made a part of the State University. There you have the buildings. You cannot use this fund. You cannot use the principal. All you can use is the interest of it. Why will Senators stand here and oppose this bill? It asks for not near so much money as the separate propositions do. Your normal school is asking for one hundred thousand dollars. This bill proposes seventy-five thousand dollars and the University but twenty-five thousand dollars. The Senator from Wayne objects to the fact that in the second section there is a provision pledging the faith of the State to this amount being annually appropriated. That is only part true and part misapprehension. It depends upon the views of the gentlemen that compose the Board. I wish we had the power to tie the hands of posterity and appropriate fifty thousand dollars for this purpose. I would do it for this reason, that there is a pledge from this people older than that Senator perhaps, and myself too; the faith of the State was pledged and solemnly pledged that that institution should be made what it was designed by its founders. Its only revenue until 1867 was derived from the donation of land by Congress. Previous to that year not one dollar was taken from the State Treasury. And when Senators talk about this being extravagant, I ask if it is extravagant to appropriate money for the education of the rising generation?
The faith of the State was pledged long years ago, before the Constitution was made, and in the Constitution I find another pledge and that is that Education shall be free; that the public school system shall be maintained; that the funds belonging to that common school system shall never be diverted to any other purpose. Now my friend from Switzerland [Mr. Bellamy] makes a strong argument in this case; and the only one that has been made. He says that it is extravagant to appropriate twenty-five thousand dollars a year page: 370[View Page 370] to the State University, for he says it may cost two thousand dollars a head to graduate young men in that institution. He says there are plenty of Colleges where they can get an education with no cost to the State. I admit it; but don't his argument reach further than he designs himself? for I believe him to be a friend to Education. What is the result of his argument? The result of that kind of argument would lead to the striking down of our common school system, State University and all, because children can be educated in private schools without taxing the people therefor.
Mr. BELLAMY (interposing.) I stated that nine-tenths of the people prefer private to public colleges; and now if the Senator will state on honor that nine-tenths of the people prefer the private to the common schools then I will favor them also.
Mr. CRAVENS. I am answering the Senator's argument and say that the conclusion is legitimate. I say upon the same principle you would strike down every common school throughout the land, and compel parents to send their children to private schools. We are all proud of our common school system. There is no man who would divert from its legitimate intention one single farthing of the fund thus appropriated. It seems to me that a strange inconsistemcy is actuating Senators upon this subject. Does not every man of Indiana feel a sense of pride as he stands in front of the Asylum for the blind, of the Institute for the Deaf and Dumb or of the Insane hospital? And why is it, sir? They all cost a large amount of money. No man here dare in his place withhold the appropriation for their maintenance. I have never seen the people of Indiana aroused with such indignation as I did when the Legislature adjourned without making the usual appropriations for the support of these institutions and thereby turned the inmates out. These are the unfortunate wards of the State.
Have these gentlemen no regard for the interests and the welfare of those who are to take our places hereafter?--those who are to sit at these desks and fill these seats?--those upon whose shoulders are to rest the burden of government hereafter? I then ask if they want to deprive the rising generation of the benefits of the State University? In our common schools, well conducted and almost perfect as they are, education is but just begun. How much money is taken out of our State every year for the purpose of completing the education of young men? I say it is a shame for us in Indiana to have to leave it and go abroad to get an education. I would just as soon think of sending our young men abroad for the purpose of hunting wives.
All that is necessary is to give the State University a little care and encouragement. This has been withheld heretofore, shall it be done again? It would be charity if you will not do what ought to be done to strike it out of existence. Let it no longer be said that it is an unworthy head or capital that surmounts the column of our common school system. You have it in your power to make it what it ought to be. About one million three hundred thousand dollars yearly are cheerfully given to support our common schools, and I say it is an imperfect dwarfted system of education unless surmounted by a University. You might as well try to constitute a living man without a head or a living woman without a heart, as a perfect common school system without having at its head a University.
But an objection to the University is its location. Our fathers in locating that University followed in the path trod by all people in the world that found Universities. Where was New Haven when Yale College was founded? Where was Cambridge when Harvard University was established? It was taken away from the city of Boston. Where was Amherst before Amherts College was established, and where was Dartmouth before Brown University was established? Go to the great Universities of Europe and where were they located? At the time Oxford College was founded, where was the town of Oxford? It is now the seat of the greatest learning on this earth. It has a library of five hundred thousand volumes and thirty thousand manuscripts. Where was Cambridge in New England when Howard was established? There was not even the beginning of a town when that institution was founded.
How old is the State of Indiana? Scarcely half a century and your University hardly numbers a score of years. And look how your college has increased that was not established thirty years ago. And what has this institution had to struggle against? It has had to struggle against this nefarious prejudice of party which has been at work in legislation, and it has now to struggle against those localities that I suppose want to get hold of the endowment fund. Give it half the time that it has taken to make great Universities in other places and what may not the town of Bloomington be? Who is it can say what that once village may not be in fifty years hence? Make of our State University such an institution as should surmount our common school system--make it a University that will attract students from other States and you will not only have a city of magnificent proportion, but you will have an intelligent and accomplished society around it.
It is highly proper in a State University there should be colleges and schools or de page: 371[View Page 371] partments where an education may be completed which is only begun in the lower schools. For this you want your schools for law, Medicine and the various sciences. The Medical College could be well located here, and very properly. Here would perhaps be the best place simply because you have hospital conveniences, which you would not have in the smaller towns of the State.
But Mr. Chairman, I have said as much, perhaps, as I should. I may have said what I should not, but I am in earnest in this matter and have been for years. I either want to see the State University made what it ought to be or crush it out of existence and say the common school system shall be imperfect--say the youth of our commonwealth shall only be advanced as far as they can in the common schools and here the liberelity of the State shall end. The Constitution of our State says, learning shall be free and general. Will it be free and general unless there is a system complete in itself to make it so? If it is I certainly have estimated it differently. The State University is without a library, without apparatus, and it wants some departments completed and fitted up. I have no especial regard to locality but it is there; it was place there by our fathers; and we found it there. It was burned to the ground a few years ago with perhaps the most elegant labratory west of the mountains. It has been rebuilt, but the State did not do any thing for it.
The Senator from Allen [Mr. Carson] is opposed to every proposition in this bill. Other Senators, I suppose, are opposed to every proposition in it. If enough of them are of that mind we will vote nothing for the Normal School, we will stubbornly re fuses to locate the Agricultural College and we will say that we will have no law or Medical College.
Mr. CARSON (interposing.) I would ask if the Agricultural College fund is not bearing interest at present?
Mr. CRAVENS. Yes, sir, but the grant was made for the purpose of locating our Agricultural College in the State.
Mr. STEIN (interposing.) By the express terms of the law of 1866, unless the College is located by 1872 the money is to go back to the United States.
Mr. CARSON. Congress has once extended the time and may do it again.
Mr. CRAVENS (resuming.) Congress may again extend the time, and may give permission to convert the grant into the common school fund, and Congress may not do it. We have got the script and sold it. We have the fund in the State, and now the question is shall the College be located?
Mr. HUGHES (interposing.) This is the second or third Legislature that has tried to locate the Agricultural College. Conceding that this Legislature should not be able to do it, have we not the most perfect assurance that the next one will?
Mr. CRAVENS. I do not know by what kind of logic the Senator from Monroe reaches that conclusion. If we are to be governed by inconsistencies I should say they would. So far as the location of the Agricultural College in Tippecanoe county is concerned, I said years ago, that if I could not get it located under the shadow of the University, I should vote for the Battle Ground location. But I have this objection to all other locations: I find where these Agricultural Colleges have been established upon the independent, isolated plan, they have been failures; but where this fund has been incorporated with existing Institutions, it has, to a great extent, been a success. In every instance, fifteen States of this Union has given it to institutions already established. I now favor the location fixed in the bill, not because I am particularly in favor of Tippecanoe county, but because the bill proposes to place it under the control and management of the University. So I would favor the establishment of a Medical College here for the same reason. As far as the University square is concerned, I care not whether it is sold and the money added to the endowment, or made the foundation for a law or medical school. I only know that we have a right right to sell it and now is a good time to sell it. It is the dictate of prudence, economy and wisdom to appropriate that land for the benefit of the cause it was originally intended.
On mot on by Mr. TURNER, the Committee rose, reported progress and asked leave to sit again.
On motion by Mr. HUGHES, this bill was made the special order for half past two-o'clock to-morrow, in Committee of the Whole Senate.
An invitation for members of the Legislature to attend a musical entertainment tomorrow evening at half past eeven o'clock, at the Blind Asylum, was read by the Secretary.
On motion by Mr. CARSON, the resolutions involving the question of the bonds of the State were made the special order for eleven o'clock to-morrow.
Mr. BELLAMY offered a concurrent resolution, which was adopted, inviting Professor Daniel Read to deliver an address on educational subjects on the evening of the seventeenth in the Hall of the House.
Mr. STEIN offered a resolution, which was adopted, that when the Senate adjourn it adjourn till ten o'clock to-morrow morning.
And then--
The Senate adjourned till ten o'clock a. m. to-morrow.
